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This woman must be a lawyer cos she knows law
I’ve seen women hit men as a form of flirting
Me too and when i got fed up and asked her to stop a little louder than the 30 times before, she wasn’t happy at all
I mean, it’d work on me
I had a FWB years ago who would do that up until the day where I wasn’t able to stop the response reflex and punched her right in the tit. Felt kinda bad since it wasn’t exactly consensual, but we did worse than that regularly, so it wasn’t a big deal.
She’d still do it periodically cuz she liked getting punched in the tit, but that was at least negotiated 🤣
I hope most people can tell the difference between a punch which is playful and a punch which is intended to cause serious harm.
My brother’s SO does this to him all the time, it feels so gross to me.
I’ve had that happen as like a light tap when I said something teasing them. I think it was a test the waters of “is it okay to touch?” kind of thing. There was never any heat behind it. I’d rather they do that if they’re into me than nothing.
Yeah no this is more forceful then that, semi regular slapping on the chest/face, punching, etc.
He’s never mentions anything about it so its been nothing more than me and my wife noticing and talking about it together but it just feels weird seeing it.
You should tell him that you noticed it and let him know you are a safe person if he needs help exit… if you are that ofc
Or maybe they just like to play rough.
The only other karateka that’s ever knocked me out cold was a woman.
Roundhouse kick, right to the temple.
It was like the windows starfield screen saver, but r g b instead of white… then I was on ground, somehow.
Now that of course was consensual combat, kumite, sparring, in a controlled setting.
But if we really wanna get into this topic… tons of women physically assault men, as in, cross over the line from assault to battery. Tons of women domestically abuse their partners.
While 1 in 2 women (50%) report being the victims of intimate partner violence, 2 in 5 men (40%) do as well.
https://www.breakthecycle.org/domestic-violence-statistics/
Something like 85% - 90% of couples in the US are a male-female pair, so yeah, tons of men are physically assaulted by their female partners. Female on female IPV happens, male on male IPV happens, and I’m sure that nonbinary on nonbinary IPV happens, etc. Americans are basically just fucking violent.
I am all for the sexless and genderless standard of it never being ok to initiate physical violence, (outside of something like a clearly mutually consented to sparring bout), and that you should always do your best to de-escalate or simply flee a violent situation, that active self defense should always be a last resort.
Hopefully we can all agree that just as being generally physically stronger is not a valid justification to initiate violence, neither is being generally physically weaker.
Not to derail your excellent points about violence almost never being the answer to conflict, ESPECIALLY in personal relationships…
But is it wrong that I immediately thought you were referring to the Jordan Mechner classic game ‘Karateka’ from 1984?
Can’t say I’m familiar with that, lol.
Karateka is just the Japanese word for ‘Karate Practitioner’, like how a boxer boxes, a dancer dances, a painter paints.
Looking it up…
Oh, this is like one of the earliest fighting games!
No, no, that makes sense lol.
Like to think I fight in slightly higher resolution than that, but sure lol.
… well, at least when I am fighting and also conscious, hahahah!
Hopefully we can all agree that just as being generally physically stronger is not a valid justification to initiate violence, neither is being generally physically weaker.
Yes, and water is wet.
The source of this silly argument is not men arguing that it’s ok to assault women or initiate violence in any way. The original argument was about hitting back when being assaulted by a woman. It was a common believe* that you could never hit a woman, not even when you’re being assaulted. Then the "equal rights’ folks started saying “equal rights? so I can defend myself when woman attacks me same way as when a man does?”. I have no idea where the “you can just assault people” argument came from. I assumed it’s just a joke. I can’t believe people are seriously arguing against it.
*at least where I was growing up
I have no idea where the “you can just assault people” argument came from. I assumed it’s just a joke. I can’t believe people are seriously arguing against it.
They’re arguing against it because it’s a straw man, and they don’t want to say “Yes, you can defend yourself against a woman who is attacking you”.
Just getting in before the equal rights and equal lefts chud-brigade turn up.
people keep talking about human rights, but what about human lefts?
Why would i talk about human left? They’re not in the room anymore!
I simply do not believe this conversation ever happened
Legally in most parts it’s considered battery, which is worse.
In the state of IL, to even threaten is considered assault. Meaning, you can’t say, “I’m about to hit you.” In many other states, assault is any impediment of one’s volition. Any use of force is battery, which is why the two are often paired together, and you can get charged with assault and battery.
Yes, assault can be as much as only threatening to hit someone.
I mean the whole thing of “a man should never hit a woman” suddenly sounds a lot more valid when you morph it into “a strong person should never hit a weak person”. Like if you have a physical advantage over somebody else, don’t abuse it.
No one should be hitting anyone. If you initiate violence accept the consequences. I’m a small dude, do you think I shouldn’t get my ass beat for punching a bigger guy?
But in that same vein the weaker person shouldn’t antagonize the stronger person without expecting an appropriate response.
It’s like an argument I always had with my ex. Women claim they’re afraid of men being violent towards them then go out of their way to antagonize all the men around them and then act shocked and act like they’re the victim when the men around them react to their antagonizing.
You can’t have it one way on a two lane road
No if someone is attacking you, you defend yourself. Don’t punch back full strength, measure your blows.
idk i think ppl shouldnt hit other ppl unless it’s with consent or in self defense/defense of others? even if someone is “weaker” they shouldnt hit someone “stronger” without a good reason.
Yeah, otherwise you assume a physically smaller/weaker person cannot be an abuser. Which is plain wrong.
Especially because abuse has many shapes
I feel like that sounds great, but what if somebody calls you like a racial slur or something? There are absolutely non-violent acts that I think would be worthy of a slap in the face.
Why?
Society is better if people think randomly yelling racial slurs might get them popped in the jaw.
Is it? Afaik teaching people through fear isn’t as effective as other methods, but if you can show me some research suggesting otherwise I’m open to looking it over and changing my mind
Oh, this isn’t about teaching, it’s about restraining. Nobody who isn’t either a child or a bigot needs to be taught why you shouldn’t go around screaming slurs. The more people that think someone will pop them one if they say wildly bigoted things in public, the better.
If you have any evidence that randomly saying slurs in public somehow leads to a less bigoted society you could share that. But I’m pretty sure it just leads to the acceptance of bigotry.
In what world did I suggest that’s what I want. Are you capable of considering there are other methods to achieve the goal we are both pursuing without encouraging the use of violence over people saying offensive shit?
Never thought to phrase it that way, imma keep that one
How about “don’t hit people”? Being weak doesn’t warrant not being an abuser or a threat.
Strong/weak people of any gender shouldn’t hit other people. But if you choose to start a fight, don’t be surprised when the other person decides to play along.
“Start shit, get hit” is a phrase to live by, because you can’t assume someone is going to take your abuse without giving a little back.
also like, if a stranger starts fighting me, I have no idea how far they’re gonna go. It doesn’t matter if they’re just tryna throw a light punch or w/e, I’m gonna assume my life is in danger and will act accordingly. Anyone willing to fight a stranger is incredibly unstable and dangerous as a default, regardless of gender.
Equal rights, equal fightsOr how about we don’t start fights with people. That’s called assault.
The correct question is: “So you’re fine getting drafted?”
The correct question is: “So you’re fine getting drafted?”
No one should be drafted.
It works both ways, don’t worry.
No one is.
Also, why do people get into arguments over this to begin with? On the mens side specifically?
Like has it ever occured to them that maybe if you treat eachother right and with dignity that it won’t come to violence?
I get that people dissagree and even get a little grumpy at eachother sometimes, that’s human. But ffs, what are you 12?
If the assaulting side was reasonable this would work.
The problem is that people give the assaulting side more of a pass when it’s between men. The whole “boys will be boys/men can be rough with each other” mentality enables the violence at a systemic level.
They also tend to give it a pass when it’s woman on man battery. Same with rape.
Because it gets drilled into most boy’s heads from a very young age that you are never to strike a girl, not even in self defense. Violence by women against men gets a pass to a degree that’s almost ridiculous, including sexual violence - though with sexual violence it’s baked into the systems and discussions around it to the point that I can actually find you quote from people involved with researching or dealing with sexual violence being pretty explicit about the double standard and treating it as obvious.
Decent shitpost but wrong community?
yeah, assault is okay in 196 🥰
Or even 197 😍
particularly if they are nazis
nazis aren’t people so human rights don’t apply in the first place.
They are humans, very shitty ones, and it’s still totally okay to punch them in self defense.
I remember when I was a toddler, the neighbor toddler girl hit me in the face with her shoe. When I hit her back, I got in a lot of trouble and was told not to hit girls.
Would have been a lot more sensible if they said “no one should be hitting each other”
I’m curious how old you are. Millennial?
Yep! I’ve moved up into the 35-45 bracket on surveys and I do not appreciate the reminder of my growing age.
Hah, suck it! I’m still holding on to the 25-35 bracket and that’ll NEVER CHANGE NEXT YEAR!
Yes. I’m sorry that happened to you, it’s not fair.
This meme, while correct, demonstrates a misunderstanding of the argument.
“A man is not allowed to strike a woman, not even in self defense.” We live in a society where some version of this is drilled into every male child’s brain from a young age.
Nobody making this argument in good faith is gleefully responding to “equal rights for women” with “so I get to hit women”, because the fuckheads who want to hit women aren’t waiting for an excuse and are not mentally healthy.
Those who are making this argument in good faith could do with much better phrasing though. I prefer “Equal rights should include equal privilege.” If self defense against a female asaultant is their only concern, then it sounds like they just want to hit women. There are other issues that can and should be addressed, like a man not being able to pick up their own child or nibling from school without dirty looks or potentially having the cops called on him.
Don’t get me wrong, I understand perfectly well that in terms of privilege inequality, women have it worse. Women aren’t taken seriously by their doctors, or by the law, or in most contexts really. Women get paid less to do the same work. If a woman pursues her dreams instead of getting married and having kids, that’s sad. Women should not have to deal with any of this bullshit!
What I don’t know is how to wrap this up with a concise tldr without sounding like a whiny moid.
You should always defend yourself with the minimum necessary force.
This. But it was drilled into me by my father to never ever under any circumstance to hit a woman. And I never have, even when she sexually assaulted me. It would have been justifiable for me to hit her to get her off of me, but I know deep in my being that she would have called the cops and I would have gone to jail for battery, and she would not have had to answer for the assault at all. I still don’t really know what I should have done in that situation, but I do know that I should have not stayed married to her.
Sending warm and positive thoughts your way, you didn’t deserve that. Hopefully you’re far away from her now.
Thank you so much. I am safe now, as far away from her as I can be.
i think my grandma put it quite simple: “never be the one to start punching people. but if you do get punched, make sure you hit them twice as hard”.
she never cared about gender and never really even mentioned it. and that in a time, where gender roles where much stricter. she was the one that beat up a group of bullies, because she thought it was unfair how they treated others. played football with the boys, even though boys didnt want to kick balls with girls. but she just didn’t take ‘no’ for an answer. to show them, she just got better than most of them.
even though ske knew there is a difference between boys and girls, she never mentioned it. IMO this, combined with her being an absolute badass, takes all the wind out of these petty arguments. “i cant hit a girl”, “you better don’t, last time she beat you up”. or “i don’t want to play with a girl”, “understandable! she is simply better than you” etc.
You have a point; there shouldn’t be any excuse for assaulting somebody. The patriarchal standards hurt us all and make the world less safe.
Also, you’re not a “moid.” Fuck that word
Sorry I’m old as fuck, what is a “moid”?
If you smush “female android” together you get “femoid”, and then removing the fe- you shorten it to “moid” for the male version.
It’s obviously derogatory and it’s meant to mean something akin to “someone with [all looks and] no brain”.
I’m actually surprised Urban Dictionary doesn’t have a better definition of femoid, but they do of moid.The elephant in the room is ‘why the fuck are we gendering robots’.
My thinking is that it originated from 4chan, and over there they also use the word “robot” derogatory. And the leap from “robot” to “android” isn’t that far fetched.
Who knows, could also be inspired by Austin Powers’ “fembots”.We gendered warships centuries ago. We love gendering things.
So bimbo and himbo respectively?
Bimbo/himbo are about types of people with aesthetics and cultural signifiers. Moid/femoid are just slurs against men or women that a person of the opposite gender doesn’t like
Yeah himbo doesn’t really have the same bite. A lot of women even like a good himbo. I overall prefer a little intellectualism but I can go for a good himbo too. I’ve mostly heard it associated with Brendan fraisers roles in his youth (George of the jungle / the mummy) It gives golden retriever energy or one of those gym rats that’s always telling the other dudes their muscles look great.
a moid is an asshole misogynistic male. The term stems from “femoid” which is a misogynistic term referring to women in general, usually said by moids who are also involuntarily celibate (incels).
I prefer to not call those people moids. The whole term is toxic and does more to reinforce gender roles than oppose it. It’s not worth using at all.
I take no issue with calling toxic people toxic pejoratives. I’ll use whatever term I think will offend the target the most, because fuckem.
My experience has been that language signifies specific attitudes, attracting people with those attitudes. The type of people that “moid” attracts are more likely to view men as not just cultural problematic or practically dangerous, but as people unworthy of equal respect. The thing about people who dehumanize a large social group like that is that they are usually willing to dehumanize people for other reasons, including people they simply dislike. Those sort are rarely fun to hang out with.
The people who use that term also tend to have more regular exposure to people with other awful attitudes. People who are casually transphobic, racist, and “edgy” in a way that goes beyond jokes. In short, 4chan/Twitter regulars who would rather expose themselves to hateful brainrot than hang out in “coddling safe spaces” that aren’t astroterfed by Nazis.
Basically, toxic memes attract toxic people, and unlike pepe, there is no good buried under that term worth reclaiming. There are plenty of insults for shitty men that aren’t just genderswapped misogyny.
I thank you for this knowledge.
I am disgusted to know it.
I apologize on behalf of my gender.
Don’t apologize for things outside your control. As a species, we are still trying to outgrow the tribalism, aggression, and desire for dominance that helped our ancestors survive. Stand firm against the sophists, they exploit those old instincts rather than encourage us to rise above them.
You shouldn’t have to apologize because other people in your demographic suck.
to expand on this, I used the term moid in my original comment because I could see how my entire argument could be oversimplified to “not all men are assholes”, which is something moids say all the time when women complain about men.
Women get paid less to do the same work.
They don’t. They really don’t. Comparisons that suggest they do don’t compare “the same work” - they typically compare the median male and female total earnings which conceals a lot behind an assumption that men and women are identical aside from total pay. Once you start adjusting for things like role, industry, work hours, geography, seniority, etc the gap shrinks to nearly nothing and in some demographic cases (young, urban, single and childless for example) even flips the other way.
What flips it back though is then going deeper and asking why women are contained to certain job titles (usually with less pay) also, women don’t get paid equally in the work place when you consider any job that ever has an option for wage rises, because typically they never get them, or if they do they get a quarter of the rise against a man asking. They typically get passed over for promotions, over men, that counts as wage loss, they’re not less qualified, just passed over because woman. They did a blind test on orchestra applicants, and hid them behind a curtain so the people hiring couldn’t see gender, and then all of a sudden more women were being chosen, when previously that was not the case. Look at any male dominated industry (which typically has higher pay) and ask yourself why women aren’t equally populated there. All of that counts. And more! I think there’s like a set of steak knives too, or something.
There’s multiple effects. Its mostly just life “choices”
having the capacity to get pregnant needs to be controlled for in those studies.
The CONSAD report (one of the more thorough ones done as far as considering and adjusting for various other influences that aren’t simply sex discrimination but also aren’t equal between the sexes) actually considered career interruption from having children to have one of the biggest impacts. Not working for weeks to months has long term effects regardless of cause, and one of the most common reasons for that happening for women is having a kid.
Women also tend to work less hours/week in general which was another huge impact (both because that’s time being paid for, some of which is overtime, and also because it can influence future progression) - the standard of describing the “wage gap” in terms of total earnings rather than hourly earnings explicitly hides the effect of hours worked and I can’t imagine that’s by chance since it’s a major factor.
The argument usually goes something like “okay a woman is beating on me I’m expected to just stand there and take it because if I retaliate at all I’m the aggressor somehow” like the whole “HOW CAN SHE SLAP?!?” Video where dude has like 20 Indian men come beat the fuck out of him for retaliating
That shit was so infuriating.
He almost got killed! To make it even more bizarre, the assailants were all yelling insults about the guy’s sister, like “Your sister is a whore!” Apparently, if you want to insult somebody in India, you say bad things about their sister.
If someone is beating on you, you should take the minnimal required action to make the beating stop which normally is just leaving but sometimes can including hitting or stabbing or shooting back.
But you never “get to” hit them just like you never “get to” be rescued from a burning car. It’s not a privilege, it’s a last resort you hope you never need and the day that you do need it is a sad, dark day.
Ultimately the issue is there’s two things people are talking about:
- Occasional situations when a man has to use self defense against a woman and is viewed as the perpetrator
- Guys being way to excited to assault someone
And people just talking past each other without being clear about which theyre talking about or disguising one as the other
There’s a difference between what some people think of as self defense.
The most obvious is to act in a way that prevents harm to one self - which would only involve violence as a last resort - but many guys seem to want to see it as “an eye for an eye”, which is a very different thing.
