Why does the Democratic party have a hard on for running failed politicians? Kamala lost, let others step up. AOC would do great in the Dem Primaries
So tell me why? Explain it like I’m a 6 yo. What exactly is the appeal of AOC? Someone who once aligned herself with two antisemites? She’s not a Senator, she’s a representative for New York State. Does she have the same appeal as David Hogg? Strike me down and call me a conservatard (I’ve never ever voted Republican) but AOC is a gaffe machine, but somehow it’s on purpose? Can we talk about Ilhan Omar and Rashid Talib? How the fuck did they ever become Representatives for Minnesota and Detroit…yeah I know it’s been a minute, but this is the Democratic Party…how did Leftist get so confused that they felt the need to support right wing religious nuts? You know what I talking about right? You could take your average everyday Muslim and a white supremacist and ask them both how they feel about women/jewish people/gay people and you’d get the same answer. Did AOC support the striking train workers in 2022? The union for the rail workers never really got the deal they wanted. What does AOC stand for exactly? Just the typical Gen Z talking points? “We gotta support drag queens in libraries!” Yeah, I’m an old fuddy duddy who thinks that identity politics is a losing battle, maybe if everyone can get under the umbrella of the idea that billionaires are working to ruin this country? Maybe we can talk about wealth inequality and how no one who is working class can afford anything? Housing prices, rent, basic living income and basic standards for ALL human beings? I love Bernie Sanders, god bless him, but AOC and Bernie spreading whatever message they are is falling on deaf ears, the ears of middle America. I’ll take my beating now
Yeah, I’m an old fuddy duddy who thinks that identity politics is a losing battle, maybe if everyone can get under the umbrella of the idea that billionaires are working to ruin this country?
If that’s how you feel, you’re supporting the wrong people. It was centrists who turned to identity politics to hide their lack of an economic platform. Remember when Hillary said breaking up the big banks won’t end racism? Remember when the new DNC chair said they would still take money from good billionaires? If you want Democrats to focus on the billionaires ruining our country, AOC’s your best bet.
I love Bernie Sanders, god bless him, but AOC and Bernie spreading whatever message they are is falling on deaf ears, the ears of middle America.
10K showed up for them in Michigan. 12.5K people showed up for them in Idaho. 30k showed up for them in a Trump district in Montana. Doesn’t seem like it’s falling in deaf ears, but maybe your right, and the Democrats should just not try to win any states in the middle of the country. I’m sure that’s a great strategy.
What does AOC stand for exactly? Just the typical Gen Z talking points? “We gotta support drag queens in libraries!”
You could take your average everyday Muslim and a white supremacist and ask them both how they feel about women/jewish people/gay people and you’d get the same answer.
Get fucked, bigot.
Yep, this is the kind of ad hominem attack I would expect. You think I support Hillary Clinton? What Do you think that Centrism is about exactly? Is your righteous anger going to change the world? You’re adorable
LOL, yes, you got an ad hominem attack in response to blatant bigotry. Comparing all Muslims to white supremacists doesn’t warrent debate, but it does deserve ridicule and contempt. You also ignored a bunch of facts that contradicted your wildly inaccurate statements on who was promoting identity politics, which factions of the party were actually standing up to billionaires, and how successful the Sanders/AOC tour is in middle America, but those challenged your worldview, so you couldn’t acknowledge them. Anyway, keep punching at the left-wing of the party while the Democrats try to run the same strategy put Donald Trump in the Whitehouse twice. I’m sure you’ll change the world by losing every election!
Explain to me exactly how you view the basic tenets of Islam. How many Hadiths are there that specifically and pointedly describe what should be done with anyone who is homosexual or engages in homosexual acts? Here’s one : * Abu Dawood (Hadith 4462):
“If a man engages in sexual intercourse with another man, kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.” How do you think your everyday Muslim cleric feels about women?- Sunan Abu Dawood 2146:
“Any woman who dies while her husband is pleased with her will enter Paradise.” Don’t fucking come at me with your self righteous bullshit when you support sexist and homophobic religious ideologies. When you call me a bigot for pointing out the realities of the absolute truth about what the Quran says about nonbelievers, gay people and women, it makes you a disingenuous hypocrite. Do you support basic right wing Christian ideology? I’m sure you don’t. When you use the language that you’re using to support your own weak defense of uninformed leftist dogma, you are no better than any right wing conservative who supports the same Christian bullshit.
- Sunan Abu Dawood 2146:
“Here’s a long detailed rebuttal to your badly informed opinion.”
“Ad hominem!”
Reddit and its consequences was a mistake.
AOC is a gaffe machine
I actually think she’s pretty well spoken. A lot of people clip her just to farm outrage, but honestly, we’ve seen (especially with Trump) that out-of-context clips don’t really shift public opinion much anymore, they just reinforce whatever people already believe.
Ok look I voted for Kamala but if a candidate fails can we please run someone one else? You don’t run the same person over again because the same people who felt like she was forced down their throats are still going feel like she’s being forced down their throats.
And the same bs that was used against her will be used again. But people eat yhay shit up which is why it works.
And her tactics of bring out appealing to Republicans again is probably whay she’ll do again and that’s going to lose more dem voters.
The corporate Dems need to go away.
On one hand I want to argue against this. People were fucking dumb not to vote for her and should come crawling back. Not because shes the best, but because how the fuck did people think this was gonna turn out? Both her and Hillary were right. And people who helped Trump win, if anything, should hr asking for forgivneas, so lets give it to her.
… At the same time I have little to no faith they would. They would just double down and go for concentration camps again. So yeah, move on.
Please god give us AOC in 2028. Shes the FDR 2 we need when this is all over.
We need some sanity, not more crazy regime change nonsense. Markets don’t like uncertainties, and markets are what leads to productivity investment.
Not that Harris is any better.
Bold of them to assume there is going to be an election 2028
If Harris was a leader she would be out there touring like AOC. Shes not a leader. She had her shot to prove otherwise and didn’t.
I mean, if I were her I’d feel drained and devastated. Everything that happened during the election and people still picked Trump over her…
I have a hard time feeling sorry for her after leaving the left hanging and going after conservative votes. She made an incredibly poor strategic choice and it cost all of us.
Obviously she’s not the only one to blame here, conservatives deserving the majority of blame followed by people that stayed home, but she doesn’t deserve pity.
… not to mention she didn’t ask for a recount. That one was a red flag for me.
A recount requires a vote to be close, it wasn’t. Trump won every swing state. And with the margins he won by, every recount in the world would not overcome the 86 EVs she trailed by.
The election results were very close - and it was a big election, some ballots were rejected, there were bomb threats and there were also statistical anomalies. She should have asked for a recount.
Pity maybe not, but understanding definitely. If that were me ya’ll picked Trump over I’d tell all ya’ll to fuck right off while I prep a boat to Europe. Then all the people saying I should stay out of it would be bitching that I’m not participating anymore.
Exactly. If I were her, I’d fuck off to Europe and send a big fat middle finger to everyone asking for help.
Is that in the best interests of the American people? No. Is it an entirely understandable reaction? Yes.
If I were her, I’d fuck off to Europe and send a big fat middle finger to everyone asking for help.
Sending a big fat middle finger to everyone asking for help was basically her campaign.
Europe would be the worst pick for Harris. Maybe the Philippines or other thinly disguised police state.
Yeah. I have a lot of problems with Kamala The Cop. But she lost what might be the final election in American History. That takes a lot out of you
Not as much as it’s taking out of the rest of us, not even close.
Drained and devastated but willing to lose again? Spray this turd down the drain of your empathy and out of a leadership roll.
They cheated, and we ALL know it. If she’s upset about anything, it’s that she was cheated out of her historic legacy, and the spineless Democratic party backed HitlerPig over her.
You feel sorry for that god awful campaign?
So she should be all recovered by '28 then? /s
Exactly why she’s not a leader. A leader understand that you don’t have time to lick you wounds when the enemy is at your door. She should be fighting harder now, not sulking.
If she’s still drained and devastated months after losing, she’s not emotionally mature enough to be president. What’s going to happen the first time a soldier gets killed in combat? At least Hillary has some cajones, Harris never gave me that impression.
At least Hillary has some cajones, Harris never gave me that impression.
Hillary had years of experience on the federal level. Senator and then Head of State. She was used to making choices that had a big impact.
I will always remember Harris for her DNC nomination debate performance. She personally called out Biden’s racist policies and how it impacted her. Showing that out of touch white men have lasting impacts on generations children. It was her highest moment. If you check articles they’ll say that was one of the highlights of the event.
And then became Biden’s VP. Just willing to ignore how he personally wrote a racist bill that harmed you because it’s a position of power? Alright. That’s sure a message about your morals.
And when asked about why by Steven Colbert: “It was a debate!”
Tim Walz is a white dude. Democrats need to stop fucking around. We’re back to a place in history where women nor people of color are winning a presidential election. It’s the unfortunate truth.
That’s the thing, we’re sick of the same old same very old. Walz wasn’t super bad, don’t get me wrong, but the democratic voter is ready for change. Long since ready. It’s only the DNC that hasn’t caught up. We want more left than appeasing centrists. We’re tired of reaching out a hand across the isle to bring back bloody stumps.
If you think that Hillary and Kamala lost just because they are women, then you haven’t been paying attention. They lost not because they are women, they lost because that is what we were told we were getting. We all wanted rocky road ice cream, and they gave us vanilla. Then they wondered why they lost out on business. Fighting against fascism didn’t seem to be enough for many. It blows monkey chunks that it had to happen when we have a fascist party taking hold, but it is hopefully a shake up that will actually get noticed.
It isn’t about color or gender, it’s about where they fall on the scale of things as well as age. Stop forcing that vanilla ice cream. We want the rocky road.
We all wanted rocky road ice cream, and they gave us vanilla
I feel like you missed an important point here. We didn’t all want rocky road, we argued quite a bit on what ‘‘new and progressive’’ flavor we wanted. Some people even wanted vanilla.
The MAGAts won because they were united in not caring what flavor they got, so long as certain folks weren’t allowed in the ice cream shop.
I think Kamala and Hillary are 2 very different people. Idk why everyone keeps comparing them…maybe because they’re sexist? Kamala is likable Hillary is disingenuous and not very personable
I don’t agree with this take. Most of the people who wouldn’t vote for a woman of color for that reason wouldn’t vote for Dems in the first place.
The failure of Kamala and Hillary was in trying to pander to the so-called moderate swing voter crowd which largely doesn’t exist.
Refusing to run a strong woman candidate to appease racists is not how you win.
I don’t agree with this take. Most of the people who wouldn’t vote for a woman of color for that reason wouldn’t vote for Dems in the first place.
They know. It’s just an excuse to shut out progressives.
Dems just need to have a primary. In a perfect world, some kind of ranked choice or popular vote. AOC wins the primary, great. If Walz wins, also great. We just need a primary dude
Ideally then whoever doesn’t win becomes the running mate
Obama is one of the most popular presidents in my lifetime. Hillary won the popular vote. The problem wasn’t being a woman or a person of color, their problem was being shitty candidates that the public doesn’t like, running terrible campaigns.
I’m old enough to remember Michael Dukakis…Tim Walz gives me Dukakis vibes
We’re back to a place in history where women nor people of color are winning a presidential election.
How to tell that a progressive woman of color is having a moment.
Yup, definitely a moment where someone just told me it is working by revealing they can’t admit that part of themselves is afraid of a world more progressive than they are because of how it invalidates cynicism core to their world view, life choices and judgement.
Edit, referring to the person you responded to.
As long as we always come up with a fresh excuse for why progressives can’t run.
Wait why is Harris even running again? I don’t think she’s that bad but I can’t vote in US elections - the electorate rejected her.
I’m shocked that Harris is in first place…
I used to be shocked Biden was #1 in 2019. Turns out, name recognition matters more than anything else, and Harris had a historic campaign budget. (Not that it was used well, but AOC has never had that level of PR)
Not so sure about that, I knew who Cortez was years before I recognized Harris and I’m not in either of their districts.
But you are commenting on Lemmy, which i’d argue makes you atypical and your media/news consumption probably looks very different to that of the average American.
Technically I’m on Mbin, but I get your point.
That said, I was hearing her name in broadcast and print news reports way before Harris and I visit a wide variety of websites.
I only knew about Cortez because my MAGA cousins would rant about her and the Green New Deal and I decided to look her up.
“Ehrmagerd we’ll be forced to live in unpolluted cities where everything’s within a 15-minute walk! I’d rather die!”
A poll looking 3 years ahead is about as accurate as an astrological chart (and just to be clear, those are worthless).
Only a shock to folks who still think Democrat centerists are what’s gonna win the votes
“We want to maintain the status quo that led to the election of Trump twice!”
I will vote for AOC with pride. But I’m leery about running another woman right now. Neither Hillary nor Kamala could win against Trump.
That said, I can’t think of anyone I’d be happier to vote for. I dream of her being President. I don’t know if swing states will have it, but I would fight to make it so.
Hillary Clinton won the popular vote. There’s no statistical difference in the chances of victory between men and women when running for political office. Lots of Republican politicians are women. I don’t see it as a big deal.
Also, lots of open racists voted for Obama. If you look at the polling and the interviews, it was much more about running conservative Democrats trying to get the votes of people who wanted to shake things up. That’s what Obama promised, that’s why Sanders would’ve won, by some measures, and it seems AOC is out there generating the same buzz.
AOC is a progressive. Harris was too, prior to her role as VP.
She ran with Progressive planks, but she was a DA. She’s a cop. Cops aren’t progressive.
Attorneys aren’t cops. Can we stop with the right wing smear campaign?
District Attorneys work for cops and for the interest of the government. They’re worse than cops… They empower, protect, and exonerate cops.
This isn’t a right wing smear, it’s a reality check for libs still clutching their pearls over their shitty candidate.
And yet, the cops hated her…
Cops are not progressive, they protect the interests of the state, not it’s people
I’d vote for AOC over Kamala, 100%.
I mean, I still voted for Kamala, but I wasn’t excited about it.
She’s an amazing candidate. I’d vote for her. I dunno about the rest of the country tho. They seem to really appreciate white men when it comes time to vote. All other issues be damned.
Just let the white man win better than this orange one in office. we know both sides still prefer them stop fighting this bullshit
It’s kinda bullshit and could be addressed with some light propaganda messaging over the course of 5 years. It’s a direct result of Fox news propaganda, and historically engrained racism. Be cool to adress it as such in the open light especially with an AOC candidate over the next 4 years. Even if it meant stepping down for a different candidate i think they should start her campaign funding soon and try and build a brand that works with the masses.
Second place to Harris??? Holy fuck we deserve our fate.
Edit: upon reading the article (I know…) AOC has the best net favorability. So a little more hopium there.
This poll is pretty pointless, as far as actually getting to know who people specifically want. The top runner this far out is pretty much always the last person to have run, because the political climate hadn’t changed that much and nobody has campaigned for the next nomination yet.
The important takeaway is that AOC, and presumably progressivism more generally, is getting more popular.
The majority of the voting population answers this question based on name recognition alone. You’re way more up to speed on the options than the average American voter. We need to put energy into getting people like AOC in front of as many disengaged and unaware people as possible. NOT complain and whine that everything isn’t handed to us on a platter.
She’s in second place and we have 3 years to move her into first, that sounds worth a shot to me. But go ahead and throw your hands up in the air, tuck your tail, and say there’s nothing we can do.
We are closer than we’ve ever been in my lifetime.
I’m curious, do Americans even have a “Modern World” class that explains current world politics in high school?
The majority of the voting population answers this question based on name recognition alone.
Yeah I read the article, that headline is almost misleading in its support for Harris if anything. AOC has the best net
NOT complain and whine that everything isn’t handed to us on a platter.
She’s in second place and we have 3 years to move her into first, that sounds worth a shot to me. But go ahead and throw your hands up in the air, tuck your tail, and say there’s nothing we can do.
I shouldn’t have to educate grown adults on shit this important they ought to desire to learn on their own. They should know who the hell AOC is JFC. So I’m still disgusted, just significantly less so. And like, I’ll inevitably try to promote AOC, but I don’t owe this country shit. I want to leave, I only can’t thus far due to money/resources.
AOC would receive my vote.
Welcome to American politics, when the 2028 election begins in 2024 and the 2028 primary began in 2020.
I’m so tired.
