main

  • Horse {they/them}@lemmygrad.ml
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    19
    ·
    6 hours ago

    the idea of a single “western civilization/culture” is a ridiculous (mostly) yankee fantasy, there is very little in common between most of the so-called “pillars” of it


    • PorkrollPosadist [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      10
      ·
      edit-2
      5 hours ago

      “Western Civilization” is the Amerikkkan form of what “Israel” does by claiming a 3000 year ancestry to the land of Palestine, or what Nazi Germany did by framing itself as the “Third Reich.” In all three cases, you have a relatively new national formation, bereft of a common history or a rich cultural canon of its own, but desperate for the imprimatur of historical immortality.

      It is all tacky Disney Land bullshit. It has to be, because the claim in all of these cases is to be the Main Character of the totality of human history. It is the pinnacle of hubris.

    • InexplicableLunchFiend [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      5 hours ago

      same with “judeo-christian”. In the 19th century it was a term to describe Jews who converted to Christianity. That’s it. Wasn’t talking about any overarching joint Christian-Jewish shared culture or anything like that.

      It wasn’t used in its modern context until the 1930s, when it was invoked heavily by FDR to combat anti-semitism of the Nazis. So the very first use of it was against other Christians, to try and create a united home front that included Catholics, Protestants and Jews. It was never put away because it became a useful tool of anti-communists and zionists, who fearmongered about “irreligion” and atheistic communism coming for them - and to get Christians to join the Zionist cause. It became increasingly Islamophobic and used as a bludgeon against Islam specifically after the Cold War and during the war on terror.

      It’s not this thousand years old shared tradition of values. Jews and Protestants and Catholics went through periods of bitter hatred and also mostly peaceful coexistence all around the world, but they never considered themselves all under the same umbrella until the modern age Liberalism and Zionism forced them into a group that is incoherent in almost all ways except that it has utility for white supremacy and American imperialism.

  • mar_k [he/him]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    22
    ·
    7 hours ago

    Ironic bc historically, Ancient Greece generally had more technological and cultural exchange with the Middle East/ eastern Mediterranean ex-Byzantine states than cultures we today consider “Western.” I mean present-day western Turkey was literally apart of Ancient Greece and an integral part of Hellenistic culture!

    “Western Civilization” is a blurry, incoherent concept younger than the US, almost like a civil religion with Greece as the bs founding myth. Western Europeans even looked down on Greeks as primitive others for all of medieval history, until the last century they noticed and whitewashed their historical achievements

    Fun fact: Ancient Greece spent centuries without a writing system (The Odyssey was originally a long oral tradition passed by word of mouth for 400 years), before they borrowed the alphabet of the Phoenicians (present-day Lebanon/Syria), which later became the basis of the Latin alphabet. That’s not to say Greeks were backwards, just that the Fertile Crescent had the head-start of civilization. (Very few cultures have independently invented written language, and none of them are European)

    • Formerlyfarman [none/use name]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      edit-2
      6 hours ago

      Aren’t all writing systems in use today borrowed from high Punic, except for Chinese and and the Korean system?

      Edit: I meant other people invented writing, but the punic script is more efficient on paper, parchment, etc, as opposed clay tablets.

      But yes you are right h regarding Greece, according to Greek mythology Cadmus prince of tyre founded Thebes in beotia and brought the alphabet.

    • InexplicableLunchFiend [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      5 hours ago

      Yep, it wasn’t until the “enlightenment” that people started giving a shit about recreating Ancient Rome and Greece (other than the Holy Roman Empire of course and other break offs). Throughout the middle ages people considered themselves more advanced than the barbarians who came before. They retconned history in the Enlightenment/Renaissance and invented the “dark ages” myth. Medieval technology was in most respects far more advanced than that of the Romans/Greeks.

    • iByteABit [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      ·
      6 hours ago

      Good article, it really is exactly like that here. An imperial outpost, heavily exploited both before and after its liberation from the Ottomans, a whorehouse of a country that survives as the West’s dock, military base, and “exotic” retreat for rich people who will get each of their disgusting desires taken care of, and once in a while its used for its propagandistic value as the birth of “Western Civilization”. Of course the reactionaries within it also chug that Kool Aid and think that they have more in common with Hans who was slaughtering their grandparents some generations ago than they do with Mohammed that arrives here running away from the bomber planes that take off from the NATO bases that occupy our land. That admiration from the West doesn’t last long, they always come back wagging their fingers at the workers saying that they’re lazy and don’t pay enough tax money to be funnelled to Europe, never mind the fact that working 8 hours here is a lucky minority.

  • DoofusAscendant [he/him]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    14
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    9 hours ago

    Bit idea: keep placing ancient Athenian fertility statues closer and closer to Rubio as he speaks.

    NSFW (tastefully carved twig 'n berries):

  • ChaosMaterialist [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    10
    ·
    10 hours ago

    Look I was just smoking the western stakes like I was told… Oh. Oh. Smoke the western stakes with Hickory. Sorry I totally got things confused. I probably shouldn’t follow Sublime’s advice about two joints…