Yeah, this is kind of what I’m talking about. You can’t on one hand say you’re for progressive leftist ideals, which are centered on human rights and democratic freedom and then also employ the rhetoric of a far right dictatorship. You’re just soft-selling authoritarianism at that point in defense of some empty label.
Criticizing the US is one thing, even wanting their power balanced by other nations is sensible, but pretending the CCP is anything but a far-right totalitarian dictatorship isn’t productive if the goal is a world with more opportunities for progressive ideas to take root – there is no scenario that manifests out of the CCP increasing its geopolitical influence that isn’t objectively worse, regardless of what bones there are to pick with the right-wing in the US. The goal should be defeating the far-right in the US, not kneecapping the US so the CCP can start expending their imperial ambitions.
China accumulating power only moves the global needle further towards authoritarian norms, not away from them. It results in more cross pollination between right-wing groups internationally. We are witnessing it right now, as US democracy declines (not US power) and China rises we see a not-so-coincidental rise in far-right groups everywhere else too (which China and Russia happily foster and weaponize. Very progressive of them).
In the US (or any democracy) there is still much more political diversity, so if you criticize US actions you’re really criticizing one of those groups and their abuse of US power. By contrast, China has a single state party with a single person at its head with more or less unrestricted power. It is quite a few steps ahead on the road to fascism even compared to the US. So it doesn’t make sense to try and bill them as the same thing.
There is no internal force within China working to reform it, not even potential for it, but there are progressive groups in the US pushing against the right-wing authoritarianism rising in their own country. If there weren’t we wouldn’t be seeing the evolution of public perception on issues like Israel/Gaza. That is a direct result of Americans themselves pushing from within using their (slowly diminishing) rights. You see nothing like that in China because it’s simply not possible, fascism is already locked in there. It doesn’t help you or anyone else for them to gain more influence.
Dictatorship and authoritarianism are diametrically opposed to every progressive political goal, they aren’t concepts that can be harnessed for some greater good, they are never a means to an end.
This is because, as you allude to, the defining characteristic of the “left” is that it is always looking to evolve society past the solutions that have proven to be failures (like monarchy, theocracy, corprotocracy, communism, libertarianism etc.) in favor of decision-making that’s based on reality as we understand it now and can be adapted without concentration camps and mass graves.
“Leftism” is when people try to use knowledge for the goal of fostering human dignity, well-being and freedom, but it is also when people are ready to cast aside ideas that fail to produce. It doesn’t matter what flavor of progressive someone is, those are still the central defining notions that unite anyone inclined to be “left wing”.
If someone finds themselves defending ideas or groups that don’t serve those basic purposes they’re simply no longer promoting progressive/left ideas – they’re promoting failed ideas that will inevitably be incorporated by the right to open new routes to the same resolution as any right-wing effort. That’s what conservativism is; a failure to move as our understanding of reality moves.
So, yeah, some people only just becoming politically aware might have muddled thinking about things they were taught along the way, but they need to be shown how those ideas don’t really reinforce the end goal they actually want, not to have those ideas treated as legitimate and valid forms of progressive political philosophy. They need to be taught how to examine any idea for what it is, not what they want it to be.
This is the problem with having loyalty to labels, specific theories and personalities over basic principles and practical realities. You become inflexible and vulnerable to having your good intentions exploited, ending up in these weird positions where you’re supporting the very thing you claimed to be against (like self-proclaimed leftists who still defend Stalin or the CCP despite the mind-boggling levels of human suffering they’ve produced)
I don’t care about implementing one specific left-branded ideology or another, my concern is more with ejecting conservative political thought so that ideas and information can be discussed and debated to find the solutions that actually produce good for everyone. That simply isn’t possible until the people get past the corpses of their darlings, whatever they may be.
That deliberation should be able to happen without people dogmatically attempting to shoehorn in ideas that have already been tried and failed. Progressives should not be precious with ideas that way and should be willing to label ideas based on what they produce in reality, not just in theory.
Yeah, this is kind of what I’m talking about. You can’t on one hand say you’re for progressive leftist ideals, which are centered on human rights and democratic freedom and then also employ the rhetoric of a far right dictatorship. You’re just soft-selling authoritarianism at that point in defense of some empty label.
Criticizing the US is one thing, even wanting their power balanced by other nations is sensible, but pretending the CCP is anything but a far-right totalitarian dictatorship isn’t productive if the goal is a world with more opportunities for progressive ideas to take root – there is no scenario that manifests out of the CCP increasing its geopolitical influence that isn’t objectively worse, regardless of what bones there are to pick with the right-wing in the US. The goal should be defeating the far-right in the US, not kneecapping the US so the CCP can start expending their imperial ambitions.
China accumulating power only moves the global needle further towards authoritarian norms, not away from them. It results in more cross pollination between right-wing groups internationally. We are witnessing it right now, as US democracy declines (not US power) and China rises we see a not-so-coincidental rise in far-right groups everywhere else too (which China and Russia happily foster and weaponize. Very progressive of them).
In the US (or any democracy) there is still much more political diversity, so if you criticize US actions you’re really criticizing one of those groups and their abuse of US power. By contrast, China has a single state party with a single person at its head with more or less unrestricted power. It is quite a few steps ahead on the road to fascism even compared to the US. So it doesn’t make sense to try and bill them as the same thing.
There is no internal force within China working to reform it, not even potential for it, but there are progressive groups in the US pushing against the right-wing authoritarianism rising in their own country. If there weren’t we wouldn’t be seeing the evolution of public perception on issues like Israel/Gaza. That is a direct result of Americans themselves pushing from within using their (slowly diminishing) rights. You see nothing like that in China because it’s simply not possible, fascism is already locked in there. It doesn’t help you or anyone else for them to gain more influence.
Dictatorship and authoritarianism are diametrically opposed to every progressive political goal, they aren’t concepts that can be harnessed for some greater good, they are never a means to an end.
This is because, as you allude to, the defining characteristic of the “left” is that it is always looking to evolve society past the solutions that have proven to be failures (like monarchy, theocracy, corprotocracy, communism, libertarianism etc.) in favor of decision-making that’s based on reality as we understand it now and can be adapted without concentration camps and mass graves.
“Leftism” is when people try to use knowledge for the goal of fostering human dignity, well-being and freedom, but it is also when people are ready to cast aside ideas that fail to produce. It doesn’t matter what flavor of progressive someone is, those are still the central defining notions that unite anyone inclined to be “left wing”.
If someone finds themselves defending ideas or groups that don’t serve those basic purposes they’re simply no longer promoting progressive/left ideas – they’re promoting failed ideas that will inevitably be incorporated by the right to open new routes to the same resolution as any right-wing effort. That’s what conservativism is; a failure to move as our understanding of reality moves.
So, yeah, some people only just becoming politically aware might have muddled thinking about things they were taught along the way, but they need to be shown how those ideas don’t really reinforce the end goal they actually want, not to have those ideas treated as legitimate and valid forms of progressive political philosophy. They need to be taught how to examine any idea for what it is, not what they want it to be.
This is the problem with having loyalty to labels, specific theories and personalities over basic principles and practical realities. You become inflexible and vulnerable to having your good intentions exploited, ending up in these weird positions where you’re supporting the very thing you claimed to be against (like self-proclaimed leftists who still defend Stalin or the CCP despite the mind-boggling levels of human suffering they’ve produced)
I don’t care about implementing one specific left-branded ideology or another, my concern is more with ejecting conservative political thought so that ideas and information can be discussed and debated to find the solutions that actually produce good for everyone. That simply isn’t possible until the people get past the corpses of their darlings, whatever they may be.
That deliberation should be able to happen without people dogmatically attempting to shoehorn in ideas that have already been tried and failed. Progressives should not be precious with ideas that way and should be willing to label ideas based on what they produce in reality, not just in theory.