A lot of the transgender people I’ve befriended and even dated. They all stick to the simple things.
They don’t really care about whatever the hell the pronouns have gone to. They just wanted to be the opposite sex. Some, wanted to be no gender. Others, were genderfluid. They weren’t pretentious by coming up with 50 different genders and 50 more ways to call them by.
Yeah but you know, if you want to be taken seriously, you need to be a little more realistic.
I’m having a hard time taking zie, zim, zis and all that seriously. Even if they have meanings, you’re really sounding like you’re treating your identity like it’s a title a child gives themselves to like it’s a flavor of the week.
Neo pronouns are essentially just another experimental project to combat some of the linguistic issues behind using they/them singular pronouns. Consider you use singular they/them pronouns for people you don’t know ("I found someone’s cell phone, I will try to get it back to them. ") or some people get confused if their attention wanders and someone starts talking about a non-binary person whether you are talking about a single person or not.
Some non-binary people find they/them pronoun options to be dehumanizing or dislike the linguistic effect problem… However there isn’t a cultural concensus on a strictly singluar non-gendered pronoun. There are a handful of established neo-pronouns but they are akin to regional varieties born out of very specific communities but non-binary people are not a monolith. Even inside our communities there’s a lot of variation. The attempt to try and normalize new language across is board isn’t high on a lot of people’s priority list who are fine with the path of least resistance because they are dealing with a lot right now. People who use neo pronouns know it’s a big cognitive ask but they are doing it for the same reasons any trans person who asks for an accommodation - a quality of life issue. Something about the status quo is actively not working for them. It’s not based out of a desire for attention or a way to feel unique - quite the opposite usually it is nerve wracking asking for an accommodation knowing people will likely treat you as lesser for asking.
So just because you have what you need out of an accommodation you are going to turn around and put up barriers for other people who are not served by your level of accommodation?
If they/them pronouns work for you that’s awesome. It’s in a way another path of least resistance… But there are some people do hope for more from their nearest and dearest. Generally speaking they like all of us take what we can get from the people who legitimately wish them well.
Turning around and dumping on someone else’s accommodation the same way others dump on yours so you get to feel “respectable” is pretty classless. Maybe take a step back and realize the company you keep when you act like that.
Don’t stereotype people by the online facade. I’ve met maybe one weird trans person who fits the stereotype but most of the time they are normal people
I’ve met plenty of people who fit stereotypes, and are not normal well-intention ed people. Trans or straight or cis or whatever. Plenty of people just lean into their own stereotype purposefully… these are also the same folks who are obsessed with social media, trends, and policing what is ‘cool’ or ‘strong’ or whatever image they want so desperately to project.
I put pronoun police into the same category as bro-dozer drivers. insecure assholes who are desperate to be recognized.
A lot of the transgender people I’ve befriended and even dated. They all stick to the simple things.
They don’t really care about whatever the hell the pronouns have gone to. They just wanted to be the opposite sex. Some, wanted to be no gender. Others, were genderfluid. They weren’t pretentious by coming up with 50 different genders and 50 more ways to call them by.
And most of all, they just wanted to be accepted.
Part of accepting someone is accepting their pronouns since it’s part of their identity.
Yeah but you know, if you want to be taken seriously, you need to be a little more realistic.
I’m having a hard time taking zie, zim, zis and all that seriously. Even if they have meanings, you’re really sounding like you’re treating your identity like it’s a title a child gives themselves to like it’s a flavor of the week.
Maybe they don’t care if you take them seriously, they just care if you respect them enough to just call them what they want to be called.
I call people by whatever pronouns they like out of he/him, she/her, or they/them. French pronouns, no.
Neo pronouns are essentially just another experimental project to combat some of the linguistic issues behind using they/them singular pronouns. Consider you use singular they/them pronouns for people you don’t know ("I found someone’s cell phone, I will try to get it back to them. ") or some people get confused if their attention wanders and someone starts talking about a non-binary person whether you are talking about a single person or not.
Some non-binary people find they/them pronoun options to be dehumanizing or dislike the linguistic effect problem… However there isn’t a cultural concensus on a strictly singluar non-gendered pronoun. There are a handful of established neo-pronouns but they are akin to regional varieties born out of very specific communities but non-binary people are not a monolith. Even inside our communities there’s a lot of variation. The attempt to try and normalize new language across is board isn’t high on a lot of people’s priority list who are fine with the path of least resistance because they are dealing with a lot right now. People who use neo pronouns know it’s a big cognitive ask but they are doing it for the same reasons any trans person who asks for an accommodation - a quality of life issue. Something about the status quo is actively not working for them. It’s not based out of a desire for attention or a way to feel unique - quite the opposite usually it is nerve wracking asking for an accommodation knowing people will likely treat you as lesser for asking.
What those kinds of people are asking for is asking to be treated like they’re special.
For some of those people to be demanding equality, they sure have a poor grasp on the concept.
And I’m non-binary and I don’t ask for sprinkles and other special shit to make me feel so special just to “stand out” from the crowd.
So just because you have what you need out of an accommodation you are going to turn around and put up barriers for other people who are not served by your level of accommodation?
If they/them pronouns work for you that’s awesome. It’s in a way another path of least resistance… But there are some people do hope for more from their nearest and dearest. Generally speaking they like all of us take what we can get from the people who legitimately wish them well.
Turning around and dumping on someone else’s accommodation the same way others dump on yours so you get to feel “respectable” is pretty classless. Maybe take a step back and realize the company you keep when you act like that.
What if it were a new national identity? Do you call people Taiwanese? Why not just Chinese?
It’s not.
True national identities are just social constructs
Just like genders!
Bingo!
Don’t stereotype people by the online facade. I’ve met maybe one weird trans person who fits the stereotype but most of the time they are normal people
I see you’ve skipped the bits where I had said something about I don’t know, having known transgender people.
The message is a follow on in agreement
I’ve met plenty of people who fit stereotypes, and are not normal well-intention ed people. Trans or straight or cis or whatever. Plenty of people just lean into their own stereotype purposefully… these are also the same folks who are obsessed with social media, trends, and policing what is ‘cool’ or ‘strong’ or whatever image they want so desperately to project.
I put pronoun police into the same category as bro-dozer drivers. insecure assholes who are desperate to be recognized.