Why I’m skeptical of some puzzling polls

  • mosiacmango@lemm.ee
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    8 个月前

    Its had some “nazi bar” issues, i.e “we dont like nazis, but its cool if they come to our bar with their nazi friends and spend their nazi money here. If more Nazis show up, the more the merrier!”

    They back tracked from the above a ways after outrage, but it’s soured people on the platform.

    • mozz@mbin.grits.devOP
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      8 个月前

      Except it’s not a bar, it’s a web site where you only interact with people you have affirmatively decided to interact with.

      It’s like if there is a Nazi living in your apartment building, and specifically forbidden by the laws of physics from doing anything physical to anyone or making any statement or posting any literature to anyone who hasn’t decided they want to hear from them. The risk of everyone in the apartment building deciding to become a Nazi in that situation is small.

      I actually agreed with their viewpoint, and the fact that they had to backtrack after a noisy section of the community blew up at them, and that noisy section of the community decided that they were still bad people even though they’d backtracked, and now are “soured,” is to me much more of an indictment of that section of the community than it is of Substack.

        • mozz@mbin.grits.devOP
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          8 个月前

          I think you and I are just not gonna see eye to eye on this.

          The one additional thing I’ll say is, the Nazis on Substack were absolutely undetectable to anyone who didn’t choose to interact with them, but a bunch of people absolutely freaked out about them, to the point that it did a bunch of damage to a platform that was absolutely a positive force for good, just because people would have had to share the platform with literally about 0.05% Nazis somewhere out of sight.

          Contrast with that, Lemmy clearly has some level of infestation of shills masquerading as real people with political opinions, and they impact the discourse every day. Some of them, if I had to guess, I would guess are actively funded by people who are actively in league with Nazis. You know the ones. Although, that’s pure speculation on my part with basically nothing at all behind it beyond guessing. The impact to the discourse is the only part I’m confident about.

          I haven’t seen any level of freakout about that. Just an occasional bleat of “yo it’s not cool that this is happening,” and then business as usual.

          • snooggums@midwest.social
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            8 个月前

            Me

            Being unaware is very different than knowingly accepting their company.

            You

            The one additional thing I’ll say is, the Nazis on Substack were absolutely undetectable to anyone who didn’t choose to interact with them, but a bunch of people absolutely freaked out about them, to the point that it did a bunch of damage to a platform that was absolutely a positive force for good, just because people would have had to share the platform with literally about 0.05% Nazis somewhere out of sight.

            It’s like you can’t read and understand a simple sentence. Or you just like defending nazis, that could be it too.

            • mozz@mbin.grits.devOP
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              8 个月前

              My point is that the Nazis were not “in my company” on Substack. I didn’t read them, I wouldn’t even have known where to find them or how to interact with them without putting some effort into finding out. The fact that I knew they were there somewhere doesn’t change that.

              There’s no call to get insulting with me about that or pretend that I’m saying it because there’s something I can’t understand. It’s simply the truth. You have your viewpoint, which as best I understand it is that even using the same platform as an overt Nazi is unacceptable to you, which, okay, fine. But pretending I just can’t understand something or I like Nazis is why we’re disagreeing is just condescending and wrong.

              Like I say, I think we’re just not gonna see eye to eye on that aspect. Just repeating ourselves at each other probably isn’t productive.

              • snooggums@midwest.social
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                8 个月前

                Make up your mind.

                I actually agreed with their viewpoint, and the fact that they had to backtrack after a noisy section of the community blew up at them,

                You agreed with them that it was cool to have nazis on their website, and disliked the fact that they capitulated to noisy people who didn’t want nazis on their website.

                You are defending nazis. That is what you are doing.

                • mozz@mbin.grits.devOP
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                  8 个月前

                  You agreed with them that it was cool to have nazis on their website

                  Yep

                  and disliked the fact that they capitulated to noisy people who didn’t want nazis on their website.

                  Yep

                  You are defending nazis.

                  Defending Nazis’ right to exist on Substack, yes. Defending their viewpoint, no.

                  Anything else I can clear up for you?

                  • snooggums@midwest.social
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                    8 个月前

                    This isn’t a disagreement about whether a tomato is a fruit. You are saying that people have the right to promote an ideology that promotes genocide.

                    Why don’t you see that defending an ideology based on hate is defending that viewpoint?