• Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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    7 months ago

    War is messy business and not wanting to put your life on the line is understandable - after all nobody in this comment section is barred from volunteering to fight, or at least provide logistical support, in Ukraine if they’re so motivated. Most of us are happy to financially support the war but wouldn’t want to risk our lives. Agreed. most the people wanting to send in troops should be the first to be sent in. I have no desire to fight for Ukraine but I don’t mind supplying the weapons.

    The issue is Ukraine needs manpower, and if you are an unreliable citizens, then what should be the consequences?

    • xmunk@sh.itjust.works
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      7 months ago

      As I said - it’s fucking complicated. Do you owe your life because you were born somewhere? How long do you have to live there until you owe your life?

      There are very valid concerns on both sides - I really hope that Russia is stopped in their tracks… but would you support an increased draft? Would you support it if your country was offering your life up involuntarily as part of an expeditionary force?

      These aren’t easy questions, at least in my opinion.

      • Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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        7 months ago

        I agree.

        but would you support an increased draft?

        I don’t live there, so my opinion doesn’t matter. I could say yes, but it isn’t my ass going to the front line.

        If America was invaded, yes, I would fight my country. Technically, I wouldn’t fight as I am a medical officer in the Army, but you get my point.

        Would I go overseas? I did previously but I am less inclined now. I would not want to go fight for Ukraine, this is their battle.

        • xmunk@sh.itjust.works
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          7 months ago

          I was born in America and now am a Canadian citizen. I’m pretty doubtful I’d die for either country unless their motives closely aligned with my personal value. I do regret that you’ve been downvoted so severely, your general opinion and offer of self-sacrifice is certainly something I’ve genuinely seen in people before and I think it comes from a noble ideal.

          The problem, IMO, is that this policy is far too broad and punishing. I much prefer the US approach here which has always been to offer ever increasing carrots - I’m less comfortable using the stick to increase service manpower.

          • Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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            7 months ago

            Welcome to the lemmy rage of downvoting just to downvote.

            The US wasn’t always carrots. Draft dodging was taken pretty seriously in the past. Most people don’t realize we use to draft on a regular basis even when we were not at war. That’s how a lot of young men learned their job trade.

            I get why prior avoided the Vietnam war. In my youth I would gave went. Now that I’m 50 I would have questioned the war heavily.

            • ABCDE@lemmy.world
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              7 months ago

              You called people unreliable citizens for… Not wanting to die in a war created by those who will never serve in it. I don’t want to fight nor die for arbitrary borders on the whim of whoever is in charge. Killing someone because you were forced to is disgusting.

            • redlue@startrek.website
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              7 months ago

              Lol, 50 year old who will never have to serve on the frontlines criticizing others for not dying in a war.

              I would say you’ll understand when you get older, but I think it’s too late for that.

              You’re literally the person that will be sitting back, nice and cozy, while others are out there getting shot and choking on their own blood.

              • Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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                7 months ago

                I spent many years in the military and was deployed many times over the years. So, I am not sure why you are making a false personal attack.

                I am literally one of the people who would be deployed first just like in the previous conflicts.

    • deafboy@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      There should not be any consequences! The governments should stop treating citizens like a lifestock.

      • Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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        7 months ago

        When you live in a country, there is an obligation to that country. You pay taxes, you fight in a war of self defense, etc.

        • deafboy@lemmy.world
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          7 months ago

          That’s a common misconception, but you are under no obligation to sacrifice your life for anyone without a prior consent.

          If an organization tries to control your body or demands you to sacrifice your life, it’s a dangerous cult. Run.

          • Neuromancer@lemm.ee
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            7 months ago

            That’s a philosophical topic and not the law. Legally in America if you are called you must go. Otherwise you go to jail.